E4 – Belacan and the Forgotten Ancient Empires

Hosted by Dr Noby Leong and Philip Gibson
Produced by Dr Noby Leong and Philip Gibson
Sound Design by Jack Barr

Satay? Okay! is produced by Kopi Productions Limited and supported by the Golden Chopsticks Scholarship, by the Oxford Cultural Collective Trust

A History of Malaysia, 2016, Barbara Watson Andaya, Leonard Y. Andaya
Photo Essay – Changing Tides, Staying Grounded, Ilya Katrinnada and Jefree Salim
Air – Drama Box Production
The Orang Seletar – Rowing Across Changing Tides, Ilya Katrinnada, Biblio Asia, National Library of Singapore
Orang Laut SG
Gerimis Art

Please note that this transcript may contain errors and typos

Welcome to Satay? Okay! A podcast about the foods
that have shaped Malaysia. I’m Dr. Noby Leong,
scientist, food writer and broadcaster. And I’m
Philip Gibson, photographer and tomb raider.
And in this series, we explore the history, cultures
and cuisines of Malaysia from the ancient lands
of Southeast Asia. all the way through to the
creation of a modern day nation. In today’s episode,
we take a look at Blacan and the forgotten ancient
empires. So find a nose peg and get ready for
satay. Okay. So in the last few episodes, we
talked about the arrival of the first people,
the fluid movement of people across the archipelago,
which we call Nusantara. Right. And today we’re
going to continue our historical journey These
disparate groups of people started to organize
themselves into trading ports, which eventually
became trade empires. And these empires became
a precursor to a recognizable Malaysia today.
Interesting. So I like this idea of, you know,
Catan, the board game. Oh, yeah. Seafarers and
pirates. This is how I’m imagining it. You’ve
got your, you know, your orange and red and white
and blue houses or whatever. building your port
settlements and you’re exporting your lumber
and your bricks. It’s very much like that, I
think. And maybe at the end of this, we can petition
Catan to make a Malay version. Yeah, well, I
mean, there’s a Game of Thrones version, which
is, well, anyway, this is not a board game podcast.
So seafarers in the Malay archipelago or Nusantara.
So I’m super excited about this. I think this
is my favourite point in Malaysia’s history because
from about the th century to about the th
century, all these… interesting events are
happening that are seeding malay culture today
as we know it and perhaps in unexpected ways
so i’m really excited to kind of delve into that
yeah no be very interesting Just to see how these
cultures have emerged out of kind of, how would
you call it? I hate to use the word cross -pollination.
That seems like such a business jargon way of
putting it. But you know what I mean? It’s like,
you know, like, you know, the exchange of ideas,
the exchange of culture, you know, introducing
of new ingredients, ways of practice, things
like that. But before we do that, let’s take
a look at belacan. Who is Bella Chan? Who is
Bella Chan? So sometimes you might come across
the word Blachan. written in English as Bella
Chan. And I don’t think people realise that we’re
not talking about a person. That is true. I mean,
I think I probably would have been one of those
people. I think when you first started talking
about it, I phonetically knew what you meant.
But then when I saw it written down, I was like,
oh, B -L -A -C -A -N. So the ka -ka -ka. But
yeah. So, yeah, Bella Chan. Black Can. Black
Can. Bella Can. Yeah, I’ve definitely heard that.
All great drag names. Oh, well, yeah. Bella Can
do what? No, I think, but Bella Chan, I think,
is one of those kind of names that has a bit
of mystique about it. It’s either Becoming John
Malkovich or a Seinfeld episode. Oh, Becoming
Bella Chan. Yeah. This sounds very dark and mysterious.
Becoming Bella Chan. Well, is it dark and mysterious,
though? So, Bella Chan is a fermented shrimp
paste. It’s used across Malaysia. It’s so popular.
It has a really pungent and unique aroma that’s
maybe difficult to describe. Well, actually,
we have a jar of it in front of us. Nobby, when
he prepares this, it is… a process, I think.
It’s a process for me to get over it. I don’t
think it’s that actually hard to prepare it.
Nobby takes these blocks, which are about the
size of, if you’re familiar with Milky Way bars,
you know, about that. And, you know, breaks them
up, puts them in the oven and roasts them on
maxi grill and smokes the house out. There is
video evidence of this on Nobby’s Instagram.
And we have a jar of it. which I am going to
open and do a bit of a sniff test. Now, this
is not fresh belacan. It’s the smoked, the charred
version of it. Immediately as I release the lid
off of this thing, though, I am hit with a bit
of a wave of the aroma. It’s definitely got the
smokiness from the charring of it, but I think…
It’s a shrimp. It is a shrimpy scent. I was getting
there. It’s, yeah, it’s undeniable that it is
definitely a fish product and, or crustacean,
I guess, but it’s got a sweetness to it. I would
say that shrimp is quite a sweet thing anyway.
It’s, I think it has a really deep shrimpy aroma.
It’s hard for me to describe the scent because
to me, this just smells like belacan. It smells
like salt. It smells like shrimp, but that is
objectively probably not what a newcomer to belacan
is going to smell. Yeah. What was that? Nigella
referred to anchovies as the bacon of the sea.
Yeah. So that’s probably the best comparison
for people unfamiliar with belacan. Salty, meaty,
umami. Yeah, yeah. And it’s also used in much
the same way that salted anchovies are used in
lots of European cuisines. Like, you know, people
might add it to a tomato sauce, they might add
it to like a pesto or something like that. And
what that anchovy does is add savoriness, it
adds saltiness. And that’s exactly what belacan
does as well. It’s just a much stronger flavor.
So commonly we would take the belacan, fry it
up and then add it to Kangkong. which is a water
spinach we might add it into spice pastes to
make curries and stews um but the other popular
way is to make sambal belacan okay so add belacan
into crushed chilies to make a condiment a spicy
condiment yeah i mean sambal was definitely something
that we ate a lot of certainly when i was coming
over for sunday dinners at your parents place
um what was the australian and your neighbor’s
response to the preparation of belacan in the
leong family house i think we did actually managed
to confine the scent to our household but whenever
my mum would either fry belacan or as i do char
belacan and we try to kind of soften the flavor
yep so whenever we char or use it in any kind
of cooking she my mum would always apologize
she would um unprompted like the smell i think
never bothered me because growing up it was just
a normal smell to have in the house and i didn’t
think it was weird but i think for my mum She
might have apologized because of how you’d normally
prepare. Blachan in Malaysia. Right. And if you’re
in Malaysia, people often have an outdoor kitchen
or wet kitchen. And that’s when they would do
deep frying, for instance. That’s where they
would char Blachan or use anything that’s really,
really smoky or smelly so that it doesn’t enter
the house. Yeah, I will say that when Nobby does
prepare the Blachan in the house, the smell tends
to linger for a few days. I had to go to IKEA
and buy one of those air purifiers just to try
and lift the smell. There was… There was one
time particularly where I think it easily took
about three days. I would come home from work
and like, you know, on the third day it was like,
you know, yeah, it was an ordeal. It’s got a
thickness to it. Yeah. It’s weird to describe
the texture of an aroma, but it definitely is
thick and lingers. It’s heavy. Yeah, yeah. I
don’t really believe certainly in the UK that
we prepare anything that kind of far out. But
even if you were to kind of consider Blacchan
as a seasoning, it’s not a liquid seasoning,
it’s a concentrated solid. So the aroma and the
flavour is really concentrated. And I think that’s
why Blacchan is sometimes talked about in the
same way as durian, as this sort of semi -controversial
food that you either love or hate, and it’s vile,
it’s disgusting. But, you know, that’s only to
an outsider palate. Right, yeah, yeah. So just
like Durian, Blachan has been talked about throughout
history by British explorers or Europeans that
have come to the shores and sampled it for the
first time. Yeah, as I say, the fare of the UK
was definitely quite unremarkable compared to
what greeted European colonialists in Southeast
Asia when they got over there. one of the governors
of the straight settlement, Hugh Clifford, described
Blatchand as that evil -smelling condiment which
had been so ludicrously misnamed the Malayan
caviar. Now, I don’t know that I would describe
it like caviar because caviar to me is quite
soft. It is… They’re quite different. Well,
the only similarity to me is the fact that they
do perhaps have a smell and that they are fish
products. Yeah, that’s seafood products, that’s
about it. That’s kind of it, yeah. He goes on
further to say… He sounds like a very fragile
man. I think it’s this irony that the British
Empire went over. to all of these parts of the
world and uncovered all of these you know native
local people and their customs and cultures and
practices and all of the rest and like we’re
so kind of affronted by it these these are at
the end of the day it’s just a smell it’s and
it’s not even that strong. I think given all
of the things that these colonialists would have
faced, you know, these guys were on boats for
weeks at sea, you mean to tell me that the men
on the ships didn’t smell rancid? Exactly! No
one was showering and suddenly Blacchan is the
most offensive thing you’ve ever smelled? Yeah,
I mean I’m sure if they’re washing with salt
water then they’re probably going to smell like
Blacchan by the time they get to Malaysia anyway,
so… Though it’s not just the smell that was
sort of offensive to them, they, these early
sort of explorers or colonialists… also blamed
Blacchan on cholera outbreaks at some point and
some people even thought it was the cause of
leprosy. So they were so affronted by Blacchan
that were freaking blamed on everything. And
that’s a pretty good scapegoating there in the
British Empire. Exactly. We did get a experience
of what it might be like though. for these early
colonists to visit the shores that were apparently
drenched in this scent. When we were in Malacca,
we visited a traditional belacan maker. So across
Malaysia, I would say that not many people are
keeping up with this tradition a lot of bloodshed
available in malaysia is industrially made and
so there aren’t many people doing it the trad
way on a small scale but we did visit one in
malacca which was fascinating yeah it was it
was a really great place certainly to take photographs
i think to kind of be able to document these
as you say dying out maybe cottage industries
we went out to this cottage that was by the the
straits of malacca actually so down the side
of the house and you did the wind coming off
of the sea did pull the smell towards you but
it you know it was salty it was a little bit
shrimpy fishy whatever but i don’t think by any
means it was rank and odorous or however these
men described it Blachan is not confined to Malaysia
it’s pretty popular across not just Nusantaran
cuisines but across many Southeast Asian cuisines
so in Indonesia it’s called Tadasi in Philippines
it’s Bagong In Thailand, it’s Kapi. There’s also
Blacchan in the northern parts of Australia,
which I think is fascinating. There are various
Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander cultures
that have been using Blacchan for a very, very
long time. But it’s also in Brunei, it’s in Vietnam,
Myanmar. So it’s really spread far and wide.
And one of the reasons that people think it’s
spread so much is because they think Blacchan
was… a way to actually preserve fish or shrimp
in the first instance. And then it’s slowly involved
into the shrimp paste that we know today. And
so this was really important for coastal communities
that relied upon fishing where you don’t know
when your next catch is going to be or how big
that catch is by preserving what you have that
allows you to kind of survive for longer. Yeah,
I mean, I think that’s something that… was
even talked about before it was like you know
methods of preservation and like you know when
like you’re doing subsistence farming or whatever
it is that you have to just kind of go with the
seasons and i think uh kirja harry in the last
episode talked about how oh we know what to do
with cabbage because of course in europe it only
grows in the in the summer and how do we keep
our mouths fed in in the winter I think it’s
a really interesting comparison with cabbage,
with sauerkraut, because the process is very
similar. With sauerkraut, you slice up the cabbage
and then you salt it. And then you eat it like
that. Blacan just takes it a step further and
dries it out into blocks. Yeah, and we don’t
have the luxury of being able to dry our fish
out in the sun here because we seldom ever get
it. So smoking was the preferred tradition of
curing fish over here. And well, salting fish
as well actually, but not in a fermented way,
I think. So belacan is this really beautiful emblem,
I guess, of the coastal connections of the various
communities. not just in Malaysia, but Nusantara
as a whole. Sort of reminds us of these coastal
communities, the seafarers, and then now how
that led to a profound shift towards maritime
trade. And cue the Pirates of the Caribbean theme
tune. Cue the Game of Thrones, cue all of it.
Yeah. So in the last episode, we talked about
the flawed borders of Southeast Asia. and how
people would flit between some ,islands,
sharing their knowledge, their language, their
culture. But by the th century, people across
Nusantara in particular are starting to set up
trading ports, not just for commerce amongst
their own community, but for global markets,
in particular India and China. But these ports
aren’t just acting independently, they’re actually
part of a much bigger, or they become part of
a much bigger coordinated empire. So there’s
two kind of main ones that are important to Malaysia’s
history. The first one is called Guntuali. And
this is a trade empire that emerged in the th
and th century. And it was based on the island
of Sumatra in Indonesia. Okay. We know very little
about this. Okay. Well, Sumatra being across
the water, basically, across the Strait of Malacca
from the peninsula of Malaysia. Exactly. So a
really critical junction point in maritime trade.
But by the th century, there’s no more gun twirly.
And it’s replaced by an even bigger trade empire
that we call Srivijaya. Right. So Srivijaya was
a, you know, a powerhouse of maritime trade from
the th century up until the turn of the th
century. So for years, you have Srivijaya
dominating trade across Nusantara and really
across all of Southeast Asia. The center of this
empire is a city called Palembang, and that’s
also on the island of Sumatra, which is in modern
day Indonesia. And later, that center of power
shifts from Palembang to a city called Melayu,
which is in modern day Jambi, also on the island
of Sumatra. There’s a lot there. There is a lot
there. I recommend getting out a map and just
having a look at… where Sumatra is. But it’s
quite interesting if you keep going for this
Game of Thrones analogy and, you know, the Free
Cities and Westeros and all of that sort of thing.
You can totally imagine it. I feel like there
is a TV show to be made out of these empires
and these movers and shakers and players and
influences that were in that area at this period
of history. I’m so up for a swashbuckling adventure.
based around Srivijaya. Yeah. Well, there’s a
lot of backstabbing in family drama. Exactly.
In the book, The History of Malaysia by Barbara
and Leonard Andaya, there’s about pages
in the first kind of chapter or so of the book,
which you’re introduced to so many characters.
Your mind starts to kind of just go nuts over
like who these people were and how they came
to be in, you know, fathers and sons and brothers
and, you know, betrayal. Yeah. So a big shout
out to a history of Malaysia where a lot of this
information comes from in today’s episode. So
the rulers of Srivijaya, they weren’t just in
charge of the ports around Sumatra. They were
really in charge of many other trading ports
across the Malay Peninsula, which was across
the Straits of Malacca, perhaps also Borneo and
various other parts of the archipelago. And so
I guess the question then becomes… Why and
how did Srivijaya come to dominate maritime trade
in the region for years? So let’s set the
scene. Seventh century, we’re in Asia and two
huge economic centers have emerged. One is in
India and one is in China. And trade between
these two places is already occurring to some
extent by land because you’ve got the Silk Road,
but also increasingly maritime trade is happening.
Yeah, probably much easier to move large amounts
of goods by boat rather than on the backs of
horses and carts. And you also have to remember
at this time, China’s not unified. So you’ve
got southern dynasties, but also northern dynasties.
So access to the Silk Road becomes different.
Yeah. So if you look at a map, Indian China,
what’s between them? The Himalayas. Very big
barrier there. But if you think about the coastal
route, long way from the southern coast of China.
to the coast of india and what’s in the middle
of them the superhighway called the strait of
malacca the straits of malacca and the broader
area of nusantara so the lands of malay peninsula
and sumatra become particularly important now
because ships must go through the straits of
malacca which is the sea between them but not
only that this area is at the starting point
of the monsoon winds and so the monsoon winds
connect india and China with Southeast Asia.
So they’re this really important, I guess, climactic
phenomenon that ships rely upon to really speed
up maritime trade. But these also were quite
seasonal, weren’t they? Very seasonal, very predictable.
So traders knew exactly when to take them. So
ports in the Straits of Malacca, in and around
the Straits of Malacca, become perfectly positioned
as the halfway point between india and china
it’s perfect for traders to travel there by the
monsoon winds they can dock they can rest refuel
restock repair everything and then they can travel
back several months later when the monsoon winds
are favorable yeah yeah but that’s not the only
reason why this region becomes particularly important
the other reason is because products found across
Nusantara can’t be found anywhere else in the
world. What you have are products from the jungle,
like rattan, resins, woods, ivory, exotic birds.
You’ve also got these warm coastal waters that
have tortoiseshells, coral, and you’ve also got
a lot of metals in the region, tin, iron, gold.
Not forgetting spices. Spices as well. Massive
trade in spices. And so it’s for these reasons,
it’s geography, it’s favorable climactic position,
and also the products that make trading ports
along the Malacca Straits to be particularly
prosperous. But this alone doesn’t explain why
Srivijaya managed to control so many ports. Because
why would an independent port just cozy up to
a bigger empire? I would be concerned by it.
You know, jokes about our seafarers and pirates,
Catan. But, you know, if you’ve got all of this
trade moving between this, what is not a very
wide body of water, you can imagine that there
would be a lot of kind of like greed and corruption
and envy, which would lead to outbreaks of violence
and skirmishes and things like that. You know,
I don’t imagine they had a maritime police force,
but, you know. Well. No? Actually, they kind
of did. Right. And that’s how Srivajaya… retained
its power. It had a naval force that was greater
than any other in the region. And this naval
force was powered by the Orang Laut. Okay, different
to the Orang Asli. So, yes and no. So Orang Laut
are one of the indigenous peoples of the region,
and they often come under the Orang Asli indigenous
banner today. Oh, okay. But often you would think
of Orang Asli people as more inland, whereas
Orang Laut are on the sea. Because the direct
translation is men of the sea? Yeah, people of
the sea, sea people, things like that. Orang
Laut were exceptional sailors. They had incredible
deep knowledge of local weather and the local
environment. They knew how to navigate. They
knew the tides. They knew where the sandbars
were. They also knew how to survive on water,
where to catch fish. how to use the mangroves,
and they also knew how to fight. And if you were
a trader and you were passing the territory of
the Orang Laut, you would have likely been raided.
They would have, you know, boarded your ship
or whatever and took everything from you. And
in ancient Chinese texts, sea captains wrote
about pirates in that region and they were probably
talking about the Orang Laut. There you go. So
they have this incredibly long history in the
region, but also a really critical… part of
maritime history in Malaysia and across Southeast
Asia. So the rulers of Srivijaya, I’m not sure
how, but somehow they managed to command the
loyalty of the Orang Laut. Perhaps they were
doing a lot of profit sharing. And so there was
a mutually beneficial. So Orang Laut would police
the seas. They would ensure safe passage. They
were occasionally hired as like pilots to help
sea traders get around the Straits of Malacca.
Sure. But they also attacked enemy ports. So
if you were a sea trader going to an enemy port,
Onglawood might intercept you. So it became beneficial
for ports all across Nusantara to align themselves
with Srivijaya. When we talk about the Srivijaya
Empire, is that confined just to Sumatra? Or
does that actually span into the peninsula, into
where Singapore is, or even beyond into Java?
So the center of… I guess administrative power
certainly and where the rulers were. They were
based on Sumatra. But Srivijaya did extend its
influence far beyond that. Definitely to the
Malay Peninsula, possibly to Borneo and to different
parts of Nusantara. There you are. A thalassocracy.
A thalassocracy. Word of the day. So what I find
fascinating about this whole history of Srivijaya
is that it really represents a fascinating point
in time. that may have influenced Malay culture
today. And so a lot of what I’m about to say
is speculation, but it’s not unfounded. But of
course, whenever you’re kind of looking at ancestral
cultures, if you’d like, you do have to leave
some leeway based on the evidence that you have.
Right, yeah, of course. But when we talk about
Malay culture, I guess, what is Malay? Who are
Malay? And one theory is that Srivijaya influenced
this concept of what is Malay. Because Srivijaya’s
capital was named Malayu, that’s where people
think that the term Malay may have come from.
Is this city there today? Well, the city today
is called Jambi. Oh, right. So it is, I guess,
technically still there. But from about the th
century, there are written records of people
referring to themselves as Malay. Okay. So that’s
really interesting. And then you kind of think
about aspects of culture that are important,
like language. And if you’ve got all these different
trading ports, if those trading ports are operated
by one culture, but they rely upon other cultures,
the source products, you need a common language.
Right. And so you can see how a common language
might have evolved by having lots of disparate
ports scattered all across Nusantara. And then
you think about how the Malay people operating
these ports must have needed to act. They were
operating a business. They were welcoming international
trade into their harbors and into basically their
homes. And if you wanted to keep those traders
happy, you had to kind of have generous hospitality.
And so it is possible that the hospitality of
the Srivijaya rulers and also the people that
operated the ports could have influenced. the
generous hospitality of Malay households today.
You would be more inclined to do trade in a friendly
port than an unkind port. And then it’s not just
Malay culture that Sriwijaya influence, it also
influence Indian and Chinese cultures. So the
general kind of understanding is that as far
back as maritime trade has existed in Southeast
Asia, there’s always been some sort of Indian
and Chinese community that have settled and started
living in Nusantara. Okay. And so today, you
know, Indian and Chinese communities make up
the second largest population of Malaysia. Right.
And those communities, some of them have gone
back hundreds and hundreds of years. Right. So
Srivastava has influenced so many different aspects
of Malaysian culture. And if you think about
this in the context of the last episode we did,
where we talked about Nusantara, the shared history
and culture of people in Southeast Asia, the
rise of empires like Shivjaya are part of that
shared history and culture. Okay, that was a
lot of information. That was a lot of information,
but it’s painting a very rich picture, I think,
of the complexities that go into the foundations
of a culture. I don’t think you can gloss over
it. Hopefully our listeners are keeping up with
this, but feel free to pause and reflect. And
yeah, as Nobby says, definitely get out a map
so you can kind of get a bit of context and see
where these maritime passageways are and where
Palembang in Sumatra exists today. You have Singapore
as that free port today. existing in exactly
the same capacity to do trade between China,
between India and onto the Middle East and into
the Suez and beyond to Europe. So it’s almost
like places like Singapore, just almost like
a continuation of the maritime trade that’s happening
in that region for a very long time. Yeah, I
mean, it would take some massive… geological
event to disrupt the Strait of Malacca and change
the way that the boats would transit their goods
between these massive areas of commerce, I guess,
for want of a better word. So again, this kind
of connection between Srivastava and our culture
today is speculation, but I also think it’s kind
of fun to speculate. Yeah, I mean, I think it’s
healthy to have an open mind with these things,
you know, as, you know, again, coming at it from
the kind of European perspective, Britain’s been
invaded by… many people over the times from
the Romans to the Vikings and all of them will
have left their marks in the place, you know,
you only have to go like underneath the foundations
of buildings in London to find all of the Roman
ruins that are there behind left behind and Hadrian’s
Wall and things like that. So, you know, I certainly
know even in Scotland, you know, we were invaded
by the Vikings about a thousand years ago and
that I think has even left pieces of their language
in our dialect. So, you know, important. If you’re
enjoying this episode, you can follow us on social
media at SatayOK. We’ll be sharing beautiful
photos taken by Philip of Malaysia, its people,
and of course, the food. We’ll also share photos
of Malaysia from the archives, so you can see
how the country has changed over time. You can
also find links to give us a tip or donation
to show your appreciation for the work we’re
doing. So head to our socials at SatayOK or visit
our website, SatayOK .com. But I want to go back
to our chat about the Orang Laut people. Because
as much as we appreciate Malay culture or Malaysian
culture as a whole today and how we can understand
its origins, we don’t really have that same appreciation
or even acknowledgement of Orang Laut culture.
Yeah. If I hadn’t heard of the Orang Asli, I
certainly hadn’t heard of the Orang Laut. Yeah,
yeah. There’s very little talked about Orang
Laut in mainstream media. I think it is starting
to improve a little bit, but really not a lot.
So in order to find out more, we spoke to Ilya
katrinnada. So she is a cultural researcher and
writer who’s based in Singapore, and she’s done
a lot of work with Orang Laut communities in
that area. Hello, I’m Ilya. And I’m a cultural
researcher and programmer and I’m also a writer.
Okay, so the Orang Laut, Orang Laut means sea
people. And Orang Laut are broadly speaking communities
of people who live on the sea. So we’re in Singapore
and Malaysia. uh previously in history like before
the establishment of singapore and malaysia there
were several sea communities that lived a more
nomadic kind of lifestyle so what they did was
that they had certain areas within um the sea
the waters around singapore and malaysia that
they used to travel to so they didn’t necessarily
stay at one particular spot but they would travel
on their house boats to different areas of the
sea depending on where they feel they could search
for food and they would build temporary shelters
at their areas before moving to another area
after like say two or three weeks These communities
aren’t a homogenous cultural group. While there
are some similarities in culture, there are differences
too. I would say that there are similarities
in the sense that all of them have a very close
relationship to the sea. So they’re very familiar
with the marine environment as well as the coastal
environments. But in terms of culture, they would
have different languages. And I think one similarity
that I’ve seen also across different Orang Laut
communities is that there’s like a belief in
the world of spirits. Yeah, and the different
environmental features often house, I would say
different spiritual entities live in various.
environmental features, and there’s a very strong
awareness of that. Whether you’re from Malaysia,
Singapore, or from abroad, if you haven’t heard
of Orang Laut communities, that’s not surprising.
Little is taught in schools and Orang Laut, like many
indigenous communities, face immense challenges.
Also, I think broadly speaking, because for Orang
Laut, they are very much indigenous communities
that have been around for a very long time. I
think across indigenous cultures all around the
world, there is that stereotype that indigenous
cultures or indigenous communities are very backward,
uncivilized, and unfortunately that kind of perception
still persists. So I would say that really contributes
to why we don’t really know much about Orang
Laut. Modernism is also shaping these communities.
As they shift to a more cosmopolitan lifestyle,
elements of their culture begin to disappear.
um go to certain areas to look for certain types
of fish or that they know how to look for mussels
and they know how to look for crabs um so and
all these requires like specialized equipment
right that that they would construct out of natural
resources that they find so um right now when
A lot of the orang Laut communities, they live
closer to the land or they live on land. And
a lot of children, they don’t spend as much time
as their ancestors out at sea because of things
like not having to go to school, thinking about
their own economic situation, working in jobs,
in offices, in factories. All of this will contribute
to why a lot of the… Orang Laut communities,
it’s very difficult for them to continue practicing
their culture, their maritime, the knowledge
that has been passed down simply because there
are a lot less opportunities to practice this.
In order to preserve the culture of Orang Laut
communities, Ilya has been part of a research
team to conduct oral interviews to ensure that
knowledge is preserved. So for the oral history
project, the person who initiated it, Kame, she
realized that the Orang Seletar group, so they
are a branch of the Orang Laut. So this Orang
Seletar, we don’t hear much about or anything
about them. So at the moment, there are like
nine villages in Johor Bahru. And she was very
interested in documenting and archiving the stories,
their oral histories as told by them. So I hopped
on board and yeah, I begin from there. Okay,
so we started off with oral history interviews.
So we went to several villages and we spoke to
some of the elders about their own experience
of living on the sea. So this was before pre
-independence Singapore and Malaysia. s s
so all these elders at that time they were very
they were young children and actually even up
to post -independence they shared that they were
still living on houseboats and living and moving
from place to place up until around the s
in s so that was when they could no longer
kind of like freely cross cross the borders.
Okay, so I gave you a background story is that
Singapore and Malaysia, we are separated by a
border at the Straits of Johor. So the national
borders is basically in the Straits of Johor.
So previously, they could like cross along the
Straits of Johor City, but it means from around
s, s, they say they could no longer do
that. So Apart from their own experience of travelling
on the houseboats, living on the houseboats,
we also talked about some of the stories that
were passed down. So, for example, the naming
of Singapore, they have their own version of
how Singapore was named. So, they were saying
that in the past, their ancestors were with Samila
Utama, who was sailing. around the waters of
Singapore and then he saw this island which is
modern -day Singapore and he asked the Orang
Seletar what is this island called and the Orang
Seletar said Singapulao. So Singapulao when you
translate it, it means Lion Island. So that’s
their version of how Singapore was named. I think
apart from that, we also talked about birth rituals,
like how they used to give birth in the boats
and some of the more spiritual aspects of that.
So we talked about language a little bit. So
what were some of the songs they used to sing
when they were out at sea. Yeah, so that was
the oral history project. So even though Orang
Laut communities have lived in the region since
time immemorial, they have undergone really dramatic
changes to their lifestyle and living memory.
It’s really not that long ago. And I think within
like one generation, there was really a lot of
changes that happened to the communities. Of
course, it was like in the time of modernization,
globalization. Yeah, so they saw a lot of that
just within one generation. Were they quite happy
to share these stories with you and with the
broader community? I would say yes and no. So
initially when we went, they were touched by
how there were people from Singapore who would
come to their villages and interview them. But
at the same time, I feel like the time that…
that was taken to have these interviews, it kind
of took away the time that they had to actually
go out to sea and fish and collect mussels. There
are also practical concerns on their side because
there are still coastal communities that rely
to some degree on on selling the catches so on
a more practical kind of note I think even though
we even though like I think what the work that
we were doing was is important because we do
want to like formally um document the stories
and put it in the national archives um yeah into
the national archives because we know that for
as long as Singapore exists the national archives
will still be there and like future generations
can listen yeah so that’s that’s still um the
more practical concerns but there are also people
who there are also community members rights i
think they because they understand that with
awareness there’s also more i think uh more recognition
of their communities um so perhaps that is something
that they also thought about and actually for
one of the villages that we went to. At that
point in time, they were going through a court
case because there was a case of the state and
real estate developers wanting to take over the
land that they were sitting on, that the village
sits on. And they did actually use oral history
interviews as part of their argument as part
of the defense. So I think at that point in time
also, it was tiny for us when we collected the
interviews and just sharing more about the work
that we do because there’s more awareness regarding
this kind of cases. Aside from having the interviews
in the National Archives and used in court cases,
Ilya and the research team have found other ways
to promote Orang Laut culture to a wider audience,
ensuring that these communities get the recognition
they’re after. a theatre company, Drama Box,
they actually put up like a verbatim theatre
piece based on the oral history interviews. You
know, when we think about archiving these stories,
like who will go into the archives and actually
listen, right? It’s not like the general public.
I don’t think a lot of people would do that.
But when we put up, you know, like theatre shows,
I think it makes the materials more accessible
and it creates… just more awareness of the
communities. But what the creative team did was
that they made it very clear that it wasn’t like
four actors who were performing to be orang seletar.
But they made it very clear in the play that
it was four actors who went on a journey to learn
more about the orang seletar. And I think that
having that that distinction was important because
then it kind of creates a it’s like a standard
or precedent that you know when you’re talking
about another community there’s always that issue
of the idea of representation so you have to
think about how how do you talk about another
community i think that that’s one aspect of the
play that i really really liked i don’t know
whether you have seen pictures so the play itself
like the set was that they made a mock -up of
a boat and it was really it was a really big
set and it was kind of um like intimidating i
would say like because the boat was like so in
your face so i really like that because it really
puts um the the home of the orang salita in the
middle of the whole um space of the theater show
There are also other organisations that are using
the arts to boost the profile of not just Orang
Lawut communities, but broader Orang Asli communities
too. There’s also another group in Malaysia,
GERIMIS. GERIMIS, G -E -R -I -M -I -S. So they
work with Orang Asli artists, like photographers,
I think like weavers, and also… I’ve seen before
they work with an illustrator like Pinter, a
visual artist, to tell the stories of the Orang
Asli. In the past, they’ve created photo books.
They work with Orang Seletar photographer Jefree
to display some of the photos that he took of
his community in a photo book. They did exhibitions
and there are also zines where they tell some
of the, what do you call it, folk tales from
the communities in these zines. Yeah, so I think
these kind of efforts would make people more
interested and want to learn more about the communities.
But whether or not they actually are effective
in… preserving or keeping your traditions alive.
I think it’s a different question because if
you want to keep something alive, you have to
do it. It’s incremental steps, at least, you
know, raising awareness on these traditions,
recognition. If you’re a tourist and you’re planning
a trip to Malaysia or Singapore, Ilya has some
thoughts of what she’d want tourists to know.
because they’ve never probably never heard of
before so i think for them to just know that
the communities exist um firstly that they have
existed for a long time and secondly that they
still do exist now um yeah i think that’s really
important i mean i can’t really speak for malaysia
because i don’t live there but i think at least
for singapore i think it is it’s an important
part of the singapore story i feel um yeah and
and i think it would just be nice for them to
want to know that that is uh that these communities
still do exist now and if someone maybe a tourist
was visiting singapore and they wanted to support
online communities in some ways how is there
a way that they could do that and what would
that be the best way to support those communities
Thanks for asking this question. So I think if
they go for some of the programs that I spoke
about just now, that would mean a lot to the
community. And that was Ilya Katrinnada. So Philip,
it’s always a bit sad and disheartening when
the first part of cultural preservation begins
with… Hey, we exist. Yeah, it’s a bit of an
unfortunate kind of recurring theme between this
episode and the last one. I think it goes to
sort of show the issues that a lot of First Nations
people have across the world, sadly. It’s not
just exclusive to Malaysia. And I think the difficulty
with our own local culture is that there’s a
dwindling population. The community isn’t living
in their traditional lands necessarily. And there’s
really not much available in… in terms of books,
online, you know, in the popular media. So the
race really is on to document cultures, to share
what’s available for older generations to transmit
what they know to younger generations. Because
as Ilya Katrinata said, traditional ways of life
have changed in living memory. Yeah, that’s kind
of amazing. I think her point about how it was
only in the s that… the ability to cross
the border, across the Strait of Johor, you know,
it was only in the s that that stopped being
permitted, which I think is insane that that
is only years ago. Yeah. And, you know, there
is so much culture at risk here. We have languages,
we have religions, rituals, fishing skills, knowledge
of the ocean, cuisine, and so much more. For
sure. No, it is a pity. I think I can’t unfortunately…
completely understand how their ways of life
are being threatened by encroaching property
developers and things like that no it is a shame
um i think it’s a shame that they’re taken for
granted i think but it’s not even that they’re
taken for granted because nobody knows they exist
yeah that that’s almost sadder yeah in many ways
no i think it is sadder It is at least heartening
to see that there are organisations and people
working towards preserving and sharing the culture.
So there’s Orang Laut SG, and they’re based in
Singapore, and they’ve been giving talks lately
and workshops, sharing, I think, a lot about
the cuisine of Orang Laut peoples. And while
there are certainly parallels between Orang Laut
cuisine and Malay cuisine, there are a lot of
variations that aren’t really being discussed.
There’s also Jefree Salim, who Ilya mentioned.
So he’s a photographer who’s been documenting
his Orang Seletar culture. So you can go online
and see his photos, and they’re really a beautiful
record of how his community has lived. And there’s
also Gerimis in Malaysia, who broadly worked
with a lot of different Orang Asli people in
general. Right, okay. So there are things happening,
but of course they do need a lot of support.
a lot of acknowledgement, funding, yeah. Just
a general raising of awareness and hopefully
more kind of like state support. Exactly, yeah.
So to go back to our story about Srivijaya, from
about the late th century, their power is starting
to wane. And there are multiple reasons for this.
One is that the system in China is changing,
so it no longer favours a giant empire like Srivijaya.
You also see other empires around Nusantara and
also around Thailand that are challenging Srivijaya’s
power. And also they have a loosening command
over the Orang Laut. So basically by the turn
of the th century, it’s all over Red Rover
for Srivijaya. I see. So in the next episode,
where are we heading? What are we looking at?
Well, in the next episode, we’re going to continue
our story following the downfall of Srivijaya.
with an episode entitled Spices and the Rise
of Malacca. So we’re seeing how Malacca is filling
the void left by Srivijaya. I imagine it must
have filled the void rather substantially to
have the entire body of water named after itself.
Yeah, I never really thought about that. Yeah,
well, they’re not calling it the Strait of Pulambang.
Very, very true. Very true. So join us for the
next episode of Satay. Okay.